Relating this to power/influence:
I think “conqueror” types (driven by an unchecked impulse to impose their vision on the world) have always gotten into power (in communities, businesses, governments).
I wonder how we’d elevate more “steward” types (wise boring people who hear feedback and care about the people they lead/influence)?
I've come to believe that it's a lack of self-reflection, not being conniving or manipulative, that makes someone a bad person.
Everyone engages in occasional behavior that is harmful. A "good person" takes that feedback to heart, takes responsibility for their actions, and tries to do better next time. A "bad person" pushes the thought away and refuses to reflect on their behavior.
Over time, doing that repeatedly - refusing to be morally accountable - is what makes someone a bad person. It doesn't mean they don't have the capacity for redemption, but it's impossible to collaborate with people who refuse to learn from iterated moral games.
I’m hard-of-hearing and I’ve been trying out these captioning glasses. I struggle a lot with conventional hearing aids; sometimes they’ll be turned up high and it hurts from being loud but I still can’t make out the words someone is saying. Was hoping I could just read the conversation with these and be saved!
I was overall impressed with these in a lot of ways (their weight, connectivity, ease of use), but my takeaway is that speech-to-text still isn’t quite accurate enough. It worked great in ideal conditions (e.g. captioning a movie in a movie theater), but made a lot of bad guesses in the Bart station and at a moderately busy bar. (e.g. “considerably” was translated “literally one minute”; “bummer” was “I love her” etc. etc.)
There is *one* other pair that’s supposed to do slightly better than these, so I might give those a try (they are substantially heavier and uglier though 😭)
What are some examples of communities/scenes that integrate the head and the heart very well?
my take as a disillusioned (berkeley) rationalist, after distancing myself a bit and doing a bunch of emotional work
my past self was very emotionally disembodied, stuck in my head. socially colorblind in an important way. I’m now a bit less like this, and it’s obvious to me many rationalists are in the same place I was (and still am to a fair degree). unfortunately, this is a “you’ll understand when you’re older” kind of thing, which can be frustrating and feel like “bad faith” to a colorblind person, even when it’s not. I see dynamic this happening in the discourse now.
many (most?) rationalists cannot intuitively empathize with normal, embodied, non tone deaf people. both sides see the other engaging in bad faith, because they’re operating from very different ways of being here.
anyway, my two cents, bit more below
I *really* wanted to love the dharma scene. The people have been so nice, and it's refreshing to be somewhere that's uncomplicatedly positive (no vice-signaling, etc.; just obvious earnestness and sweetness).
It has been getting harder for me to maintain "I'm just here for the community" though. The ethos is quite goal-oriented toward developing greater skill in meditating. I've spent a lot of my life in similar pursuits, but unfortunately I can't conjure much motivation for it here and now.
I went to a meditation and song circle last week where we were guided, as we meditated and sung the songs, to imagine and commit to our life's purpose. As this was happening I wished it were possible to just "be there" - not in pursuit of a far-off goal, but just as like- "this is an average weekday and I am here singing just to feel simple connectedness and joy."
Maybe enduring the "gotta grind toward self-improvement" aspect of dharma culture is the price I pay to spend time around lovely people?? Or maybe it's not a fit for me? Curious what you think
I might finally look into Dharma/Buddhism/the contemplative space.
I’ve been looking for some new centers of community in my life (physical places to gather by default, the same people repeatedly, that feel like a fit for me at this stage of life).
I’ve never been drawn much to meditation, and I don’t have any goals for it other than community. But I can’t help but notice that people who orient around this stuff feel more like-minded than average!
Honestly, a part of me worries that learning this terminology will overwrite all my current frames for Kegan 5-shaped ideas. I think the world benefits when people come at these things from different angles and with different language, so that would suck! If there’s a real click to be found though, it’d be a shame not to find it.
Anyway- is “Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha” a good intro? Or should I just start going to classes? Do I need to do a retreat to get the basics, or is that antithetical to my goal? What do you guys think is the play for me in SF?
Sometimes when I’m stressed my husband will put on a playlist of my favorite songs and spin me around. We danced a lot the last few days. I love him so much
To clarify the quote in my top tweet, my interpretation is that Aella is trying to trivialize what happened to me by calling it “nonconsensual grinding.” But having a physical struggle - pushing someone away, being trapped - is not a normal part of dancing, so I don’t think her framing creates an accurate picture. I don’t want to make any of this sound like a bigger or smaller deal than it was; I just want to speak clearly about it.
When I saw her post, it really startled me that she was elaborating about the incident without my permission, so I quickly posted this as something like a cry for help. I might delete it though if what I meant to say came out too unclear (please let me know)
It seems to me that a good life is about balancing acceptance (yin) and growth/change (yang). Growth isn't really possible without acceptance first (to see reality the way it actually is and understand the challenge). But all acceptance and no growth can be a kind of early death
Arguments between Kegan 4s feel like debates - like people trying to disprove and convince each other. Most Kegan 4s believe deep down that they have discovered the right way to live and that it should be spread to others.
Because their "system" (their values, their way of truth-finding, decision-making, etc.) is so central to who they are, contradictions can feel threatening and painful, causing a tendency toward confirmation bias.
While dutifully evangelizing their system, Kegan 4s rarely change their fundamental positions but *are* interested in sharpening more surface-level opinions and having views expanded with nuance. Kegan 4s can see that other people have different preferences or goals sometimes, however they can’t yet fathom the full extent to which “one right way” is illusory or that truth/reality itself is based on who is looking - a realization that starts to come online at 4.5-4.9 but isn’t clear and stable until Kegan 5.
In a Kegan 3 argument, one person has to be right and the other wrong.
In order to keep peace, Kegan 3s are especially gifted at letting arguments slide (“let’s just forget this and move on”). But they can’t easily hold and work with two perspectives at a time, as you’d need to do in a complex negotiation.
That’s because Kegan 3 needs the approval of the other person to feel steady and okay; there’s no sturdy mental apparatus for holding beliefs on one’s own as an individual. So when two Kegan 3s disagree, neither person can feel steady and okay, so each person must either shut out the opinion of the other to stop it from causing them distress, give up their view to take on the other person’s, or vacillate back and forth between these.
In a Kegan 3 argument, one person has to be right and the other wrong.
In order to keep peace, Kegan 3s are especially gifted at letting arguments slide (“let’s just forget this and move on”). But they can’t easily hold and work with two perspectives at a time, as you’d need to do in a complex negotiation.
That’s because Kegan 3 needs the approval of the other person to feel steady and okay; there’s no sturdy mental apparatus for holding beliefs on one’s own as an individual. So when two Kegan 3s disagree, neither person can feel steady and okay, so each person must either shut out the opinion of the other to stop it from causing them distress, give up their view to take on the other person’s, or vacillate back and forth between these.
Kids generally move into Kegan 3 during adolescence - other people start becoming "real" to them, they become subconsciously moved by their opinions (what others think of me is a true statement about my value/who I am).
Since teens' prefrontal cortex isn't fully developed, this population is especially impressionable vs. older Kegan 3s. But like all Kegan 3s they are unaware of this. This is why for example a teen might sleep with their teacher, feel that it was fully consensual/their idea, and not realize until a later age that they had been groomed to think and feel that way at the time.
At Kegan 4 (which can start coming online in someone's 20s - though most adults never fully get there), who you are feels like something you decide for yourself - your chosen beliefs, values, goals. Kegan 4s can see what someone wants from them/thinks about them and separate it from who they are. That's because they are conscious of this process as it is happening - they can *see* it, whereas Kegan 3s cannot.
Not all Kegan 3s look like people-pleasers by the way. Some use other tactics to cope with their high social sensitivity, such as:
-trying hard to tune out social judgment (repressing feelings, turning off empathy)
-accepting a “bad” image to avoid the vulnerability of trying and failing
-asserting things about themselves publicly and loudly (covertly still relying on others’ perception to hold up the belief vs. being able to hold it quietly on their own)
Kids generally move into Kegan 3 during adolescence - other people start becoming "real" to them, they become subconsciously moved by their opinions (what others think of me is a true statement about my value/who I am).
Since teens' prefrontal cortex isn't fully developed, this population is especially impressionable vs. older Kegan 3s. But like all Kegan 3s they are unaware of this. This is why for example a teen might sleep with their teacher, feel that it was fully consensual/their idea, and not realize until a later age that they had been groomed to think and feel that way at the time.
At Kegan 4 (which can start coming online in someone's 20s - though most adults never fully get there), who you are feels like something you decide for yourself - your chosen beliefs, values, goals. Kegan 4s can see what someone wants from them/thinks about them and separate it from who they are. That's because they are conscious of this process as it is happening - they can *see* it, whereas Kegan 3s cannot.
Kids generally move into Kegan 3 during adolescence - other people start becoming "real" to them, they become subconsciously moved by their opinions (what others think of me is a true statement about my value/who I am).
Since teens' prefrontal cortex isn't fully developed, this population is especially impressionable vs. older Kegan 3s. But like all Kegan 3s they are unaware of this. This is why for example a teen might sleep with their teacher, feel that it was fully consensual/their idea, and not realize until a later age that they had been groomed to think and feel that way at the time.
At Kegan 4 (which can start coming online in someone's 20s - though most adults never fully get there), who you are feels like something you decide for yourself - your chosen beliefs, values, goals. Kegan 4s can see what someone wants from them/thinks about them and separate it from who they are. That's because they are conscious of this process as it is happening - they can *see* it, whereas Kegan 3s cannot.
I got married recently, and I've wanted to write about it, but I've struggled so much to put everything into words.
This is my best attempt to explain what I learned about dating and love. It feels true way down deep in my bones ❤️
FYI I polished this up and put it where it's easier to share with people who aren't on Twitter ❤️: itsannpierce.substack.com/p/…
🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
Picked my wedding dress the same way I picked my fiance:
-Found it immediately - was one of the first I tried on when I started looking
-Fell in love with it, couldn’t stop thinking about it
-Got scared: it’s not the kind of dress I expected to wear!! It doesn’t match the vision I wrote down!!
-Politely insist on seeing more wedding dresses
-Not emotionally available to other wedding dresses
-But what if there’s a dress like THAT, but it’s like THIS too??
-That’s not a real thing
-Research everything about everything about everything about everything
-Buy the fucking dress finally
-Exhale 🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
I really like the dharma community so far. Nice folks, warmth and earnestness. Has been reminding me of the good parts of church.
I might finally look into Dharma/Buddhism/the contemplative space.
I’ve been looking for some new centers of community in my life (physical places to gather by default, the same people repeatedly, that feel like a fit for me at this stage of life).
I’ve never been drawn much to meditation, and I don’t have any goals for it other than community. But I can’t help but notice that people who orient around this stuff feel more like-minded than average!
Honestly, a part of me worries that learning this terminology will overwrite all my current frames for Kegan 5-shaped ideas. I think the world benefits when people come at these things from different angles and with different language, so that would suck! If there’s a real click to be found though, it’d be a shame not to find it.
Anyway- is “Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha” a good intro? Or should I just start going to classes? Do I need to do a retreat to get the basics, or is that antithetical to my goal? What do you guys think is the play for me in SF?
I wrote this for my former self who used to think "But I DID go on a second date and STILL felt nothing! 'Giving people a chance' never works!!1"
*whispers* Chat, she was doing it wrong
Having a “joy day” today. Might try to find a really fancy tea, read fiction, my husband wants me to play Portal! What would you do with a joy day?
There’s a really important tension in Kegan’s stages of adult development between “higher stage = more capability = better” and “all the stages are good and do something better than others.”
One way you can think about it is- people prioritize the capabilities/values of their current stage. So say, Kegan 3s do a bulk of the community and caretaking work in the world. Work that Kegan 4s might scoff at due to their hard boundaries and cold systematizing perspective. Likewise, Kegan 4s do much of the high-level strategy and quantification and coordination the world needs, because developing their systems (finding “correct” answers, having ”the best” POV and ways of doing things to achieve their goals) is *so* important to them. Kegan 5s are so much less motivated by this!
I got into the Kegan stages because Kegan stage 5 is insane at seeing the big picture and resolving interpersonal conflict. But can and should everyone be pushed through the whole ordeal to reap these benefits? Maybe not.
I think if someone is really committed to advancing their developmental stage, they can drill it. Break their current frames, replace them with new. It can be a painful process and honestly, if the pressures aren’t already present in their life, it might not be super adaptive for them. It’s possible they end up feeling alone, losing motivation to do the kind of work they used to do, etc.
I think what makes more sense as a goal than “get to the next stage” is movement itself and gauging the benefit of that in real time. Every stage has so many increments within it, and every increment of movement can make a real difference in solving someone’s current problems. This is what I hope to do with my course The Subject-Object Move: to help push people just a little beyond their current level of awareness, to solve the problems that are real for them right now, by revealing what’s still “subject” and making it “object” - opening up that next degree of freedom.
Anyway, info/sign up for the course is here: annpierce.com/som/
Early bird ends tonight, so if it speaks to you, definitely jump in before end-of-day!
Guyssss I’m super excited to say I’m running a Kegan-inspired online course! Sept 14–Oct 12. It’s called The Subject-Object Move.
People get stuck in problems all the time because what they *see* as the problem isn’t the *actual* problem. (e.g. I just need to work harder! I need this person to understand me! Why is everyone getting in my way!)
Meanwhile, the thing actually driving the problem is still “subject” - you’re looking through it (being controlled by it, under its spell) rather than at it (where you can make changes).
So with some subject-object moves, you might go:
“I need her to listen to me!”
-> “Oh, I compulsively want everyone to like me”
-> “Wait, in this situation, this person’s opinion of me genuinely doesn’t matter”
-> “I no longer feel triggered by this at all”
THIS SHIT IS GOING TO BE NUTS lol The whole course is basically us getting reps in doing this move over and over. Compassionately noticing the thing under the thing under the thing. Until mysterious behaviors and stuck patterns start becoming visible and workable.
“I’m procrastinating” -> "What am I actually avoiding?"
“I need this to go well” -> "Wait wut, why does this feel necessary?"
“This is just how it is” -> "Huh, how did I conclude this?"
Starting basic (e.g. "I notice I'm angry") and moving into progressively deeper and deeper layers.
There’ll be a WhatsApp community and optional weekly Zoom Q&A. I think it’s going to be super fun!
Link to learn more / sign up: annpierce.com/som
Reminder that the early bird price for The Subject-Object Move goes away end-of-day tomorrow (9/3)!
I'm hoping most signups come in before this deadline so I can get a headcount and start making plans 🙏
Don't hesitate to reach out with questions
Guyssss I’m super excited to say I’m running a Kegan-inspired online course! Sept 14–Oct 12. It’s called The Subject-Object Move.
People get stuck in problems all the time because what they *see* as the problem isn’t the *actual* problem. (e.g. I just need to work harder! I need this person to understand me! Why is everyone getting in my way!)
Meanwhile, the thing actually driving the problem is still “subject” - you’re looking through it (being controlled by it, under its spell) rather than at it (where you can make changes).
So with some subject-object moves, you might go:
“I need her to listen to me!”
-> “Oh, I compulsively want everyone to like me”
-> “Wait, in this situation, this person’s opinion of me genuinely doesn’t matter”
-> “I no longer feel triggered by this at all”
THIS SHIT IS GOING TO BE NUTS lol The whole course is basically us getting reps in doing this move over and over. Compassionately noticing the thing under the thing under the thing. Until mysterious behaviors and stuck patterns start becoming visible and workable.
“I’m procrastinating” -> "What am I actually avoiding?"
“I need this to go well” -> "Wait wut, why does this feel necessary?"
“This is just how it is” -> "Huh, how did I conclude this?"
Starting basic (e.g. "I notice I'm angry") and moving into progressively deeper and deeper layers.
There’ll be a WhatsApp community and optional weekly Zoom Q&A. I think it’s going to be super fun!
Link to learn more / sign up: annpierce.com/som









